Teaching in Korea

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Jay Vander
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Joined: 10/19/2009 - 14:09
Teaching in Korea

What is going on here people? Jobs on line now are over 40 hours per week for 2.2million WON. Here are some general tips:

You should not be at your school for more than 30 hours a week. This is the standard. School wanting you there from 9-6 should be paying you more. The jobs posted today are sick!

You should be getting at least 10 days paid vacation. This is the standard. However, all those jobs posted today are offering only 8. Why? Your holidays are based on a 20 day, pay system. Parents do not pay per month, they pay for every 20 days. The extra days in the month turn into your vacation days (which should be blocked as they are VACATION days-not days off). But, I am assuming here, because of Lunar and Chuseok fall during the week for the next upcoming year, the holidays have been put down to 8. But, your contract always states, 10 days plus holidays so I am not sure why the jobs posted today-for over 40 hours per week is only offering 8 vacation days.

You are allowed 3 sick days-again these are from the extra days in the month over the course of the year so take them. They are yours. If you do not take them you are working for free.

I always changed my contact to classes per week and not hours as people here never get paid for doing reports or prep work. They think this is part of the job but it is not. It is extra. Contracts state, usually, 30 hours a week or 120 a month but this can lead to problems.

Ask for more money. Your pay being offered of 2 to 2.2 is to low. The recruiter takes a big chunk of change from you and the school. Ask for more directly from the school-not the recruiter. Schools need to know that recruiters do more harm than good here. They are greedy buggers that are keeping prices down.

Your apartment should be more than 4 walls. You are university graduates, not students living in a dorm. Ask to see the accomodations first.

Anything you want in your contract add it in-but make sure it is on the Korean version of the contract. Legally, only the Korean contract holds any validity in court if you ever had to do that. You can use the english one but in the past anyway, it was not considered a legal document. The Korean one is the one that gets sent to immigration and so on so...

Really, if the job is like the ones posted today-9-6 for example, you should be making at least 2.6. If a 30 hour week job is worth 2.2, what is a 40 hour a week job worth?

Sorry for the typos as I am sure there are but I did not proof read this. I am out the door. I just couldn't believe my eyes today. Those jobs posted just made me sick. It is your life so get over thinking you are a guest and you must do whatever you are told here. Thats is crap. I am tired of seeing foreigners get taken advantage of here because they do not know any better. Koreans think they are so smart but ripping people off is hardly the sign of great intelligence. Be informed and be strong. There are many jobs out there. A year is a long time so choose well. And remember, you can quit, take off and then come back and get a new job. Forget what you have been told that you can not do this. You so can! Good luck.

John Venerikson
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Joined: 08/13/2009 - 12:36
Re: Teaching in Korea
Nice article. I am actually leaving Korea soon because the work load has gotten larger while the pay has shrunk. I fight everyday with my school. They do not seem to get I am from a First World Country and working live a slave does not jive with me-especially for 2grand a month. Schools here are not even schools, they are people looking to make a buck. The fact some people thump around the school like they are some mafia boss is comical. We are clowns hired to entertain spoiled kids who all think they are the center of the universe; and the school backs that play, not us, because they really do not care about education but rather, money. You take your job any more seriously than that then you are special. There is no corporate ladder here. Do your job, make your money and get out. I'm out!
lee-bum-suk
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Joined: 10/26/2009 - 08:38
Re: Teaching in Korea

A word about sick days, if you work at a hogwan and take them you face being fired. I've seen people lose their jobs for being sick and not even faking it. Koreans never take sick days, even if they have the ebola virus, stone cold drunk or hungover they still show up for work. University, college, EPIK programs....sure these days aren't coming out of your bosses pocket.  

Jay, nice article.

John, sorry to see a veteran leave. Everything you described is about right. There is no advancement here. I befriended a Korean fellow years ago when we both were just starting out at a university. 12 years later he is a full prof. 12 years later, I'm still in the trenches. Now I'm cool with that because I never had delusions that we were nothing more than a novelty item.  I stay now because of my wife,her business and the paid vacations (6months of them). If it wasn't for that though, I'd be gone yesterday.    

John, you can leave with a clear conscience in knowing that whomever replaces you they won't have enough hair on their ass to live up to the years and years of experience and dedication you gave.

Take care vet.    

alex green
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Joined: 04/24/2010 - 21:18
Re: Teaching in Korea

I think Korea forgot we are not Korean. If I were back home, I would never treat someone that had a skill I needed that was from another country the way we get treated here. It is crazy. I think Koreans think because they are not poor anymore that they are rich but far from it people.  Arrogance just means ignorant and insecure in my books and that is how I sum up Korea.

woodsman
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Joined: 06/24/2010 - 10:07
Re: Teaching in Korea

You just summed yourself and the other three dumdums up nicely. You're not in your country and being from wherever you are doesn't mean you should get any better treatment than anyone else. The fact is the market drives the job situation and here and with record unemployment the last few years in the West there are more and more vagabond teachers willing to take the shite jobs that you disdain, no matter what LBS says. You're being outcompeted by younger, hungrier kids. Is that too difficult to figure out?

As for LBS complaining about still being in the trenches after 12 years, dude, you barely have the qualifications to be doing the job you are now let alone become a full-time professor. Don't make me laugh.

Angel
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Joined: 08/16/2009 - 11:51
Re: Teaching in Korea

Poppycock- to write that, you are possible mentally challenged. By Market:- you mean:Young, illegal, student types.LBS knows wot he is talking about, you are FOS. How dare you criticise them,espescially a guy(LBS) who's been at it for years. You, my friend, are obviously unqualified, otherwise, you couldn't have written that h-rse sh-t.!!! You are being provocative- but we are not gonna casualties of your stupidity.

Sorry Manager, but he insulted first.

 "vagabond teachers-dumdums-you barely have the qualifications to be doing the job you are now "

alex green
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Joined: 04/24/2010 - 21:18
Re: Teaching in Korea

Agreed., Woodsman is way off. If you invite someone to your home you dont treat them well? You treat them the same as others that live there? Come on. I find that hard to believe. Everyone in the world who entertains takes the time to do things up.

My point was simply I would treat Koreans back home who were working for me better than people get treated here. It is not their country so that is always hard to deal with. I would make sure they were comfortable and so on. And knowing I needed their help for wahtever reason, I would water that flower, not disrespect it because I can just easily get another one. There is no class here. There is crude but no class.

I have no idea who you are or what you do but you kind of sound llike somone with no class or integrity. Back to the woods for you, you feral woods man!

Dogarse
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Joined: 04/15/2010 - 23:53
Re: Teaching in Korea

Would you treat Mexicans any better?

Sure, sure, sure, you're not from the United States and anyway, you treat everybody humanely and good for you but the fact of the matter is migrant workers tend to get treated like crap every where and Korea isn't any different.

I've got agree with Woodsman here. A trained monkey can do the job that most of us do and there is almost nothing to differentiate any one NET's skill set from another.  I feel lucky that I've been here a few years, got in the door early and employers here tend to favor people with in country experience but for the boat loads of newbies coming here everyday there is little to distinguish them from the faceless masses behind them and with the employment situation disintegrating ever faster in the US and other countries (45 states in deficit are about to be forced to cut jobs, including public school teaching jobs, to balance their budgets) it's only going to get worse. All we can do is hope that the opportunities Korea offers stay on the down low.

In all sincerity, there doesn't seem to be any real difference between the white face that teaches the kids  English in Korea and the brown face that cuts the lawn, builds the houses and cares for the kids back in the US of A.  Except perhaps that the white face grew up with running hot water, a Play Station and an over exaggerated sense of colonial entitlement (my self included).

Angel
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Joined: 08/16/2009 - 11:51
Re: Teaching in Korea

By your standards then? Don't bracket all people into your low life, trailer trash generalisations, some people here are highly skilled.Yes, you are fortunate to have these jobs, but don't knock us on Pusanweb.You do us all a dish-service when you put yourself down.

 A trained monkey can do the job that most of us do and there is almost nothing to differentiate any one NET's skill set from another.  I feel lucky that I've been here a few years, got in the door early and employers here tend to favor people with in country experience but for the boat loads of newbies coming here everyday

Dogarse
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Joined: 04/15/2010 - 23:53
Re: Teaching in Korea

Get off your high horse Angel and please refrain from your bigoted socio-economically supremacist insults.  You know as well as I do that the vast majority of teachers arriving here have absolutely no teaching qualifications and on their first day in the country are handed a text book, shoved into a class room and told to make the best of it and if they don't their are plenty more where that came from (most especially these days).

It's true that many do make the best of it.  I know many, ultra motivated, imaginative, creative teachers that go to great lengths to perform their required work to the best of their capabilities.  I also know many that put in approximately zero effort and just watch the clock tick by towards the end of the day. However that is really an aside, the point is  both groups arrived with pretty much identical resumes

I'm not trying to denigrate the people that come here.  I know literally hundreds of fantastic people that come here for all sorts of reasons with many varied and interesting qualifications and job histories but the only thing that actually mattered in terms of getting them here was that they spoke English and met the visa requirements.

alex green
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Joined: 04/24/2010 - 21:18
Re: Teaching in Korea
What is with the racism and so on. My point was simple, when people come from another country to help you with your biz, you take care of them. This has nothing do do with being a good teacher or not. I would treat anyone who came to my house from another country because i needed their skills better than most teachers get treated here.
Jay Vander
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Joined: 10/19/2009 - 14:09
Re: Teaching in Korea

My original post focussed on how the wages are getty worse but the hours are going up and up. 2.2 mil for 9-6 job with 8 days vacation? Are you kidding me? ESL recruiter had many jobs-and they are all the same. Are you telling every job they look for a teacher has the same requirements? No, they just skim everything off the top and try to get suckers in there. This has nothing to do with kids being hungrier. Hungrier for what-living in poverty in Korea. Crazy stuff.

Love your post Lee about people getting a lousy EPIK job...lol Alex, you are spot on. Koreans expect much from us, but we are expected to be clowns and live like they want us to live. Yet, when there is a problem at the school, the kids gets a pass and we get a talking to. And now, conditions are getting worse. It is not people like Lee or I that are going to hurt, it is those newbies that will. I am simply trying to create an atmosphere here that is good for all-not just recruiters and schools. I think we should be treated better. I agree, some are bums that come here but most are university graduates and wouldnt you say in our world, they are the best of the best? I would-regardless if they live up to your lofty standards Woody and so on.

lee-bum-suk
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Joined: 10/26/2009 - 08:38
Re: Teaching in Korea

I have never taught in middle school but a friend of mine who works in EPIK told me he has six different options of marks he could give as a grade; 95,96,97,98,99,100. WOW! Well that just about sums up the useless happy happy clown and circus argument doesn't it Jay? .Good call.  

All this talk about professionlism is actually a joke. Bettering one's self by getting an MA in linguistics or another major looks good on a resume, might get you a better job here or back home but will you ever use it in a classroom? probably not. I try to be professional as much as I can but I'm set up at every level. Students do evaluations on us at the end of the semester. It is a popularity vote; nothing more. Teachers who make students actually study and practice discipline get low marks and guess what? get canned. Those who let the students run all over them, give out good grades...get high scores and are deemed 'good teacher'. What a joke! The Koreans say the evaluations don't count for anything, really? then why do them. There is a coorilation between low grade and getting the axe, it's not rocket science.

I think Dog said a trained monkey could do our jobs. That or a middle school girl but when kids can slide through a gov't school program getting a minimum of  A+ it sets up a bleek future, false hope when they eventually get to me at university.  Koreans think our classes are a joke and that's exactly what they are chalk up to be; a novelty act. They are doing it to themselves with the way the system is set-up. We are just act #2.

Angel
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Joined: 08/16/2009 - 11:51
Re: Teaching in Korea

Get off your high horse Angel and please refrain from your bigoted socio-economically supremacist insults

Actually,  I am asking that person, not to bracket us all as monkeys, on  a public forum.

You know as well as I do that the vast majority of teachers arriving here have absolutely no teaching qualifications and on their first day in the country are handed a text book, shoved into a class room and told to make the best of it and if they don't their are plenty more where that came from (most especially these days

In your opinion- Whether people have experience, is not my point. The point is not to devalue the job, or the way we do it, on a public forum.It's like ringing the lunch bell for Pavlov's dogs. After every new negative post, the employer thinks, time to offer even less, the foreigners are worried. Employers, and their employees can read to. It is meat and drink to them, they love the scaremongering.It's a psychological tool they can use.If you buy into it, then salaries will fall.Well , in Busan, according to you.


Trevor
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Joined: 08/05/2009 - 16:51
Re: Teaching in Korea
A trained monkey could possibly do the job, but is it going to do it well. There are many native speakers (I'm not going to use the word teacher because almost always they are not teachers. A crappy online TESOL certificate doesn't cut the mustard as far as I'm concerned) who are in classrooms with students, but are not doing their job well, or from my point of view, might not be doing their job at all.The problem here is that many Korean people view any native speaker as a teacher. Many native speakers are not qualified to get a ESL/EFL job at home. If you are not qualified to teach ESL/EFL at home then you're not qualified to do it here either.
Jay Vander
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Joined: 10/19/2009 - 14:09
Re: Teaching in Korea
We are here to ammuse kids Trevor. A monkey could do that but we are not here to be real teachers. We are here because we were born in a certain country and the market needs us now. And if the market needs us, then they should act like they do. Schools want the parent's money first, then everything else comes second. The kid can be bad, disrupt class and never study but if the school keeps getting money, it is okay. Usually the teacher gets a pep talk and that is about it. I have never taught at a school where a kid has been thrown out-and I have taught at a lot of schools in my time here. As for being clowns here to ammuse, if the schools want us to e real techers then they need to pay for that. Working over 40 hours a week for 2g is a joke. "Profs" like me making 2g is a joke but we are not profs and we get 5 months off a year (my school anyway) so it is okay. But if hagwons are running from 9-6, then they need to be paying better than 2.2mil and offering 8 days off a year. Why you side with the Koreans is strange as I would think most would want more money as isn't that why you are here? You say working 40 hours a week for 2g is good? Cant you do that back home working at a 7/11?
Jay Vander
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Joined: 10/19/2009 - 14:09
Re: Teaching in Korea
Korean minimum wage is going up or just went up again but our wages have stayed the same while working hours have gone up, holiday days gone down-especially if you work in public schools as they used to get all the time off but now most schools require their teachers to come in and do nothing, inflation is through the roof and the exchange bad. When I came here in 2002, recruiters were touting how we would be making 2500 a month. Now, 1800 for doing more on top of the other problems. Schools cant help inflation or the exchange but the recruiters have kept prices down. I really wish schools just posted jobs themselves and paid to the teacher the money they would have paid to the recruiter. One small way to make more money. But I do think inflation and things like that need to be looked at when talking about wages. Ask for more money people!
lee-bum-suk
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Joined: 10/26/2009 - 08:38
Re: Teaching in Korea

''hello sir ,

sir me a student at PKNU and have less money.i want some discount on price.i want to buy this at 20000w.plz dont mind i m really want this oven to buy.''

I rest my case. This is a quote from another thread. PKNU is a gov't university and the 2nd ranked university in the city of Busan behind PNU. Do any of you actually think this response is a result of the spiratic teaching of(if any) or exposure to unqualified foreign teachers in this student's education past?

People here really really need to stop blaming us for their English educational shortcomings.  

 

Trevor
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Joined: 08/05/2009 - 16:51
Re: Teaching in Korea
You may be here to amuse kids, but I'm not. The reason they can pay 2g for a teacher is because the bar is set so low. They should revise the E2 regulations so that you need more than just a Bachelors degree to get the visa. This will restrict how many people can come here and push up wages.
lee-bum-suk
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Joined: 10/26/2009 - 08:38
Re: Teaching in Korea

 

You are correct, revising E2 regulation would increase salaries but to what extent? who would come? You think people with graduate degrees are going to come here and teach at a kindy hogwan 5days a week, 30hours/week times 50 weeks a year for even an amount like $4000/month? They'd last a month. There isn't enough asperin in Korea, or soju or captain Q or blackjoker or whatever makes you pass out in dreed of the following day . I wouldn't work teaching kids full-time as my 'real' job if it paid double of what I make at the university.   

The hogwan industry in Korea is lucky they get even greenhorn BA holders of any flavor to come here legally.  

Jay Vander
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Joined: 10/19/2009 - 14:09
Re: Teaching in Korea

Sorry Nodolan. It is true. Mid june til sept and mid dec til march. That is most universities.

I like the revision of the e2 idea. The problem would be who would come here after 4 or 5 years of uni to make 2g a month. Even if they bump salaries, with the exchange rate where Korean businesses want it, it still would not be worth it. Even part tiem pay has dropped here. I get paid 35 or 40 per hour at a minimum but jobs posted are for 20 an hour and so on. years ago, the lowest I ever saw it was 25 per class. Really crazy. Camp jobs for 8 days for lessthan 20 per hour. Come on.

Right now 24mil (2mil per month) is 20.5g (it used to be in 2002, about 29g...no joke!) Canadian money. People make only that a year working 9-6?  It really is not a lot of money at all. Again, my original post was for newbies. That is all.

Jefferson
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Joined: 07/15/2010 - 23:24
Re: Teaching in Korea

Jay, LBS and all those others that have cozy university jobs probably haven't applied for a full-time job in years. So how would they know what it's like to find a job these days? Especially in Busan.

The argument about more jobs than teachers might still be true for Korea but I can guarantee that it isn't the case for Busan. I have a few friends that have been trying to get to Busan yet still no luck. Sure they have offers in Masan and Pohang but they want Busan. They are happy with 9-6 for for 2.2 as long as the school is good but why do all schools want only Canadian or American teachers?

Is 2.2 a lot of money? Probably not but when you can save over half of it then it's better than being back home. And living a fun life. So what if you have to work a little harder or longer. Not everyone is so qualified and everyone has to start somewhere. Even LBS started at a basement hagwon job and worked his way up. So why so harsh on people that are just starting up and just want to get their foot in the door. My first job in Korea was not so good but now, I have it pretty good.

Maybe these jobs are crap to you guys but maybe to a new teacher, they aren't so bad. I would never take a 9-6 job for 2.2 million now, but there was a time that I would have gladly and I did. And I'm glad that I did as it's helped me get to where I am now. I have a good job and a good life in Busan.

Maybe consider what it was like for you when you took your first job in Korea. If you were one of the lucky ones and got a great gig, then good for you. But most have to take an entry-level job as they have no education background or experience. There's no need for you to give useless advice to novice teachers trying to find work in Busan. Good luck trying to get 2.6 million or staying at the school for under 30 hours a week. Not saying it's impossible but for the average guy getting that first job in Busan, I think your expectations are too high.


Angel
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Joined: 08/16/2009 - 11:51
Re: Teaching in Korea

It's the same old, same old, just worry warts, why waste so much time, on this nonsense? My friends have Hakwons , and they cant get teachers, there is a teacher  shortage here,I know of at least three Hakwons who want teachers and are willing to pay the right amount.So, all of doom scaremongering, weak willed, guess-estimators, give it a rest..Maybe you know a small circle of people who have suckered into these kinda contracts.That is their choice as an adult.If you have anything about you, September is not far away. You don't have to finish your contact after 6 months, blow the first year's severance to get a good job.Take the rubbish money, if you want to stay in Busan.I know lots of people who have landed on their feet, and recently. A little bit of planning & preparation, prevents piss poor performance.Those who say these jobs are easy, aren't doing them properly,Posting monkey stuff, ridiculing our jobs here , enforces the negative stereotypes, many employees may have. I suspect that for some,your priorities might be drinking and partying like mine were years ago.Busan is a great place to live, but you can live elsewhere.There are buses, subways, to there.Took me 5 years to get a UNI job, I had to wait, I freelanced, worked my butt off, to get there. I have no guilt about my circumstances, I have done my Apprenticeship.I know of others who just got jobs there within a short space of time, because they were go getters.I see a lot of folk blaming everything, inclusive of the weather, on their poor situations.

Get off your Hinnees, stop the pitter patter, and JUST DO IT.


windupbird
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Joined: 01/17/2010 - 21:40
Re: Teaching in Korea

angel,

send me the contacts of your friends who need to teachers.. that is if you are telling the truth. I have a good friend who is a good worker who is looking for a job here.



lee-bum-suk
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Joined: 10/26/2009 - 08:38
Re: Teaching in Korea

I have a MA in English, and from a real school, not something out of my junk mail folder. 15 years in Korea teaching English. Twelve of them at my university in the Masan vicinity. Real professor? we aren't given the chance woodman, you would know that if you had a clue or worked for something other than hogwans.  

All these people, hungry people as you say can come here and fight for the same piece of rotten meat. I'm not even in the same league as these transients. If you actually had read my post you would have noticed that I'm not angry about being in the trenches. I knew a decade ago this was it, all it would ever be.  

Woody if you think you've got what it takes to take my job away from me, you and your 23 year old pals can send a resume on. I'm sure your time at summer camp at crystal lake as a canoe instructor will gain you an EPIK job of 8:30-5pm 5days a week and the 2whole weeks of vacation but definately not my job.

  

 

windupbird
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Joined: 01/17/2010 - 21:40
Re: Teaching in Korea

haha

you really just posted that lee bum.

A quote from a non native speaker. Criticizing his attempt at speaking english.


Even if its to prove a point... wow





lee-bum-suk
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Joined: 10/26/2009 - 08:38
Re: Teaching in Korea

Yes, a student at the 2nd best university in Busan, who must have been studying English for six to eight years minimum starting a sentence with ''me a student''

It does baffle the mind.

woodsman
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Joined: 06/24/2010 - 10:07
Re: Teaching in Korea

And what does it say about you when you try to criticize a non-native speaker's English and use the word "spiratic" to do so-

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php-term=spiratic

Like I said, you are barely qualified  to be doing the job that you are, not based on your ass paper MA but based on your low level of compassion and empathy for anyone but yourself and your white privilege.

Nodolan
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Joined: 10/23/2009 - 11:02
Re: Teaching in Korea

Quote: Jay Vander:

Profs" like me making 2g is a joke but we are not profs and we get 5 months off a year (my school anyway) so it is okay

Jesus.......

I am very jealous of you and I won't read anymore of your "articles." 

Five months paid vacation.  Are you kidding me-

goodbye forever!

 

lee-bum-suk
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Joined: 10/26/2009 - 08:38
Re: Teaching in Korea

No, he isn't kidding you. 

People at my university were done in early June. We have no vacation classes, I'm off until early September. Pretty much the same for December and March. Sometimes the semester is done earlier sometimes later so 5-6months a year isn't a stretch.

runningfree
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Joined: 03/31/2010 - 20:30
Re: Teaching in Korea

i agree with jefferson that there appear to be only a select few voices who are so irate with the present situation of teaching english in busan. another clear point he makes is that such emphasis on money outweighing all other benefits (the experience, the colleagues, the city, the input possible, the output feasible, the recipients, an apartment, the interaction, the culture, asia on the doorstep, the way of life, etc...) is slightly excessive. i don't know many who choose a job solely based on the money and the hours put in, since it's the whole package that must meet one's criteria.

another significant point is that young graduates who come here are entitled to the EPIK and hagwon jobs as much as any other native English speaker, much the same as one would expect similar competition for a job in their home country. it's not an easy process to transfer your life blindly to the other side of the world, thus it's a dual decision (and risk) taken by both employer and employee. there are expectations from both parties and as teachers in Korea, one hopes we all do a decent job of fulfilling our role. 

the hierarchy and backlash against certain low-paying job offers and poor hours is quite surprising, since we are meant to be university educated individuals who recognise socio-economic instability and business variability. the employers adjust to the market, and while inflation is hitting a lot of long term foreign teachers who feel hard done by as wages have not radically increased, i feel we still receive a fairly appropriate salary which allows us a comfortable lifestyle. we choose what jobs we apply for and those we think are weak can ignore, but i think it's beyond expectation to demand others NOT to take these jobs. 

a final point to this endless tirade of banter, qualifications have a baseline of a bachelors. you cannot get a bachelors (legally) without opening some books, liaising with fellow students and professors, and submitting something written and orally to demonstrate a level of achievement and intelligence. that is why Korea has set their standards at this level, but times are changing. competition and awareness is growing, therefore, certificates are touted at home and abroad.

how a teacher applies themselves in the classroom along with their qualifications (masters, certificate, degree, common sense) is an individual choice and if one chooses wisely, they can succeed and have a rewarding, satisfying experience for as long or as short as they like in Korea. effective teaching can be discovered working 9-6 for 2.2m or 12 hours a week at 2.8m if one is lucky, but it's a matter of how reflective and committed one is, rather than harshly judging one's (and other's) predicament. 

i believe education will improve and change affecting many in the future.

so, what's the solution rather than brain-dole-inducing bashing on a forum? 


Angel
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Joined: 08/16/2009 - 11:51
Re: Teaching in Korea
Running Free - well said and many good points.
lee-bum-suk
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Joined: 10/26/2009 - 08:38
Re: Teaching in Korea

Angel, Jay that was great stuff. . 

There is a teacher shortage in Korea. Even the EPIK program, which is a gov't program  where you actually get paid and  on time(isn't that all that matters to a student loan re-payer?). They can't even fill their coffers. Hogwans, like Angel said are in even dire straits.

How can this be with record unemployment and the situation back home? Young people are lazy. They think they are intitled  to a white collar job of paper shuffling in some office back home just because they finished university. Teaching English in Asia is beneath them.  They'd rather sit in their parents basement, reminiscing about high-school, bonging it up and listening to smashmouth all at the ripe old age of 23. I bought my first house at that age.  

''I have to teach children? I don't like children''...this is a recent direct quote from my nephew as I tried to get him a hogwan job which pays 2.4 for 25hours a week. I know the owner personally, she is a saint in a sea of sharks. If I had 30 grand worth of student loans like this nimrod, I would steal a job if I had to pay a bill like that. 

Travis Kemp
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Joined: 12/21/2009 - 17:58
Re: Teaching in Korea
lbs.... i'll take that job... i'm bored in canada and need to come back
lee-bum-suk
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Joined: 10/26/2009 - 08:38
Re: Teaching in Korea

Sorry, she found someone Travis. I just got off the phone with her actually. I'm done with trying to help family out. I hope my nephew has sleepless nights wodnering how in the hell is he ever going to be able to pay for his student loan working at Starbucks. He can't even afford to pay the interest on the loan and rates are at record lows.  

I'm not suprized you are bored, please come back we need people like you.

Jay Vander
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Joined: 10/19/2009 - 14:09
Re: Teaching in Korea

Jefferson, you are intlligent and Iiked yoru post but you are the kind of person I am talking about-one that thinks things are okay here. Were you here 7 years ago? My original point, again, was years ago people made the same amount of Korean Won, but worked much less. I know what is going on here as I look everyday. I don't have to but I do. I like to know what is going on. With my F2 I still do part time jobs(which pay has also gone down) as well so I am looking everyday on here. So that is how I know what is going on here. 

I get nothing from this so to disagree and say 2.2 is fair, wow, you must be a newbie or a recruiter and this situation works for you. Would you not like to be making more money? Do you turn it down? Parents are paying much more now for their kids to go toschool so tell me, if schools can raise their prices, why shouldn't teachers get some of that? Yes, schols are the employers and we are the slaves but without slaves, the land goes dry. The market is getting scary. So many jobs are staying empty. The schools needto smarten up and see what is happening here.

I am just shedding light on the situation so when new teachers come here, at least they can have an idea of what is good and so on. To think of letting the recruiters make 9-6 for 2.2 the norm without some voicing concern over that is not going to happen. I am just here to help.

To be honest, I am not even sure why people still keep coming here? I know many of my friends have left as it is not longer worth it for them to be here but like them, we came here because making 2500 a month net, and working 6 hours a day, seemed reasonable. If not for that, I never would have left my job back home to come here.

With wages and working conditions the way they are, the Korean students are the real only losers here as what real teachers will ever come here for 45 hour weeks and less than 2g a month? Koreans need to see the big picture here and realize that if they are ever to become a bilingual country-which is what they want, they need to take care of the people coming here because if not, that dream will never happen. Perhaps you did not know that it is a fact Korea wants to become a bilingual country-with Korean and English as national languages. This is straight from the prez! So before you start saying things are okay here, look at the market and tell me how Koreans are going to learn english when no one will come.

As an aside, Jeju already has talked about and this may have already happened, that english and Korean are the official languages on the island. Great for them but what a joke as the enlgish there is worse than here. Anyway, ask for more money people as 2.2 is lousy pay for 2010!

lee-bum-suk
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Joined: 10/26/2009 - 08:38
Re: Teaching in Korea

English is an official language on Jeju? Stop it Jay....you are killing me, I'm rolling around on the floor laughing. What a bunch of ivory tower nonsense!! They are better off making Klingon an official language. At least that way they might get a Star Trek convention or two.

I think they need to start with Korean language teachers to rid of them of their ungodly accents. This is hilarious Jay, you made my day.

elmobuzz
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Joined: 09/21/2009 - 11:55
Re: Teaching in Korea
i just want to say there is NOTHING WRONG with 'bonging it up' in the basement.  i am sure many people would agree with the use of a waterpipe.  however, i have never heard the phrase 'bonging it up.'  if it involves a bong, i think it is a fine recreational activity.  really, what is the difference between living for free in your parents' basement and listening to SMASHMOUTH(?) and working a fifteen hour a week job and having no real work related responsibilities?  i can see loads of reasons for not wanting to work in korea, with money being the least of them.  on another note, english is listed as the official language in the incheon and jeju economic free zones.  not sure who said that, but somebody did disagree with the statement and laughed at it.  newspapers are a great source of information.  somebody once told me the world was going to roll me, you aren't the sharpest tool in the shed... what is the name of that song?  it always escapes me.   smashmouth did have some great tunes.  they always make me think of california and beaches
Angel
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Joined: 08/16/2009 - 11:51
Re: Teaching in Korea
Another rocket scientist and a comedian. Let's advertise to the whole of Korea, that taking drugs is OK.Comparing drug paraphernalia and a job, sums up this comment.
Travis Kemp
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Joined: 12/21/2009 - 17:58
Re: Teaching in Korea

  in 1998 the salary was 1.3 in seoul the hours were 96 a month. i had a jack in hours and OT pay when i took a second job that was technically split shift. this availed me the luxury of a 9-5/6/7 job given the day, with  2 hour lunch break. 

at that time subway tickets were 450 won, taxis fairs 1300 and cigs as low as 1000. not to mention despite the market crash, the cdn dollar was 800-ish won. 

by 2001/2 i was up to 2.3~2.2 million won for doing the task of recruiting, training and teaching. Thats been the norm since then. and since the cdn dollar ain't what it used to be. you actually lose on the exchange. i could have lost 1.5 mil off my pension had i sent it to canada.

its 2010, the schools that make you work 9-6 (had better allow for teachers to get out of the building for a little r&r. 

as for the "intrinsic" values of living and working in asia...the food, the culture etc... that doesn't pay off the debts one might have at home, let alone feed the belly of anyone really well.

each situation is different, and everyone is entitled to their view. but as i've said, 2002 was 2.2 its 2010. what should it be, regardless of E2 regulations or applicants Creds and Quals. if there is an actuary out there on the web reading, i'll let you provide the 2010 salary estimates, thank you.

I'm a bleeding music major, and a long time ago, i hired a lacky from kitchner who mocked the job, that EVEN a music major could get a job here. to whit, she was informed, I am a music major, your "superior".  she lasted a year, that was 2000.


I've said too much, good nite to all of you in Busan and the rest of Korea, i'm gonna do something productive in Edmonton today....maybe

lee-bum-suk
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Joined: 10/26/2009 - 08:38
Re: Teaching in Korea

Woody, this has nothing to do with compassion or otherwise. You are agruing just for the sake of arguing, grow up bro. This guy goes to the 2nd ranked university in the 2nd city of Korea and he starts a sentence with 'me a student'. A grade five student would know better.

[portion deleted]

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laniakea
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Joined: 06/14/2010 - 10:04
Re: Teaching in Korea


 

I had been teaching at KMU and PUFS in later 1990s, when Nat'l colleges were usually paid better than small private colleges in Busan.  Since I came back with my second master degree program in the US, I was asked not to teach but to hire my friends here at Kyungsung.  How awkward it was to turn myself up onto a position as a teacher to an administrator, which seems most of you guys already got experienced somehow in many ways.  I believe teaching in Busan is not so far different from teaching in the US; like at the place where I am from in Manhattan, Brooklyn, and Philadelphia.  No contract some times, deception some other times, after all human relationship counts at the most.  When I think of teaching I am definitely reflecting about learning.  Please do not think you know better than anyone else to teach to earn better since no body really got interested in getting taught by.  Stop mugging yourself!  The huge gap in Korea is that teachers only get paid by students at colleges with no sponsorship from Education Board or Dep of Edu, whatsoever, but collective business bet. schools and teachers over college kids funds.  Rather do own business in teaching Busan.

Jay Vander
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Joined: 10/19/2009 - 14:09
Re: Teaching in Korea

Ya Lee, it was a motion there by the regional gov or even from Seoul. This is no joke. It was on the news. I am not sure if it passed, though. But Jeju was supposed to be an offically bilingual island. And Korea wants this as well. I am sure you can find something about this on the net. Ask your wife to look. I will do that as well. Get back to you on the details-but I know it is true!

 

As for everything else, bad teachers, good techers, whatever, the pay needs to be more. My hope is school owners are reading this and learn they dont need recruiters, especially if you are looking to hire someone that is already here, and start paying better. Those who have been here for a while-say 6 years or more, would you have come here back then if you were making 1.6mil. This is about what you would be making factoing in the exchange and the rate of inflation. No right. Now, people are working 9-6 for 2.2 but after the exchange that is less than 2g and inflation here has doubled the price of bread, yoghurt, pop...so your pay a few years ago, with teh same economic conditions now, would be about 1.6mil I came in 2002 and 2mil was almost 2500 Canadian!