I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

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Dahlia Nacor
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Joined: 05/27/2010 - 19:09
I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

Senator Roxas remember the Philippines was the only Asian country to send troops to defend South Korea during the Korean War. Korean pro-democracy students sought refuge in the country when their country was in turmoil.The Historic alliance and long friendship between the two countries should be nurtured and maintain make full use of diplomatic channels to resolve the concerns of Korean nationals staying in the country," .In the Philippines Korean restaurants,stores ,students are also being tutored or are enrolled in schools . The immense contributions of Filipino workers to the Korean economy. These are signs of a mutually beneficial bilateral relationship.

 

hatshikusan2
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Joined: 05/29/2010 - 17:43
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

I do hope also. Many of the Korean students are going to the Philippines to study. I fact they are increasing in numbers each year.

F2 Teacher
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Joined: 09/01/2009 - 16:14
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.
They already do...I have one at one of my mornin gigs..they are hard workers...
lee-bum-suk
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Joined: 10/26/2009 - 08:38
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.
Many Filipinos that are married to Koreans teach English privately but I don't know of any that work at a gov't school or university. Koreans are still not very welcome to the idea.
Dogarse
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Joined: 04/15/2010 - 23:53
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

The thing is native English teachers possess a skill set that is impossible for Korean workers to re-produce, namely being native speakers and are thus no competition to Korean workers.  Filipino English teachers on the other hand, having learned English as a second language in much the same way that Korean English teachers have,  don't bring anything (at least theoretically, in practice it is probably different) except the ability to undercut the wages of Korean workers in what is already a fairly competitive market.

John Venerikson
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Joined: 08/13/2009 - 12:36
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.
There was a Filipino working at my uni a while back. Nice person-terrible english. If more come, it will make us look better. No offence to Filipinos personally as I have been to the Phil 3 times and love it, but their english is not at the level it needs to be for them to really affect the working climate here. They would make less than us but Korea is becoming affluent rather quickly and most parents would never want anything but the best for their kids-even if that means teachers like us...lol But serisouly, being white (sadly this is true...even Asian Canadians for example are discriminated more than white people, even though they are just as Canadian as I am, when it comes to looking for work...hate discrimination but it is what it is) and from an english first speaking country is what Koreans want. I have no problem with anyone coming here to teach but it just will not happen for the most part. Good luck to all!
Joined: 01/06/2010 - 15:07
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

Humility aside, I work at the Public School/s for several months now. I find it to have no difference at all. Natives are natives, Filipinos are also foreigners who can teach. Accent wise, it might be different... But it doesnt count that much~ at least with some other hagowns, Public Schools or Universities.

Generally speaking, personality counts best and how your  deal with your work that will sustain you there. There are alot of changes nowadays and even the choice of employing Fil teachers are slowly being preferred.

Let's be happy we got our jobs and let's keep it. No sourgrapings, no stereotypings, no discriminations, no racism among foreigner teachers, instead supporting each other will help us become stronger as teachers..

 

Chill everyone~

Dogarse
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Joined: 04/15/2010 - 23:53
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.
That post says it all really.  You obviously have a very high level of English proficiency but there are so many small errors that a native speakers would never make. That's why non-native speaking language teachers can never fill the unique niche that native language teachers have.  This is why it seems to me that if Filipino teachers do come here they will be competing with Korean English teachers and driving down wages which is why I am doubtful it will ever be allowed.
lee-bum-suk
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Joined: 10/26/2009 - 08:38
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

I just can't see the gov't opening up the flood gates to allow Filipinos and Indians or whomever to come here and teach. They really don't even want the group of seven and the only reason why schools hire us is because they must at the university level (1st and 2nd year compulsary required classes) and ever more sinister; grant money. We cost the schools very little, if anything. hiring Filipinos and paying them less equals less grant money and it's hard to skim off the top with a lowered grant bar.

Another thing people forget about is the fact that it makes no difference who you are; Canadian, Filipino, Indian, living in Korea costs money, I'm fairly frugal but I think it takes me a bare million a month minimum to live. This is with a paid for apt. also. Even a small one room has to be 400+/month. I just don't think you could live any cheaper than that whomever you are. I'm sure these teachers would be making a million a month or somewhat in that area(1.0-1.2). That leaves little to send home to Cebu.

 

143busan
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Joined: 08/07/2009 - 13:33
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

i really don't think this issue has anything to do with racism.  a filipino, with a proper visa and qualifications, CAN obtain a legal teaching job in korea.  however, because they are not native speakers of the english language, they are not going to be compensated with the same figures.  possibly the same as a korean english teacher, but not as much as a native. 

a work visa, excluding f-types, is very difficult to obtain unless you have specific qualifications in this country.  to subjectively say, 'i am a good english speaker' and to be given a visa to teach english in this country really doesn't make any sense at all.  thats like me, born and raised in the u.s. but fluent in korean, be given a visa in a foreign country to teach hangeul, just by saying i know the language. 

there's a reason why in order to obtain an e2 visa, you must be a passport holding citizen and have graduated from a university in the u.s., canada, australia, the u.k., new zealand, south africa, or ireland.  please correct me if i missed one. 

as for qualified, filipino f2's, they are free to attempt at landing any job in the country that they please.

Trevor
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Joined: 08/05/2009 - 16:51
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.
I know someone from the Philippines who has an F2 and is working in an elementary school. If they have an F2 visa they can apply for any job they want, it depends on whether or not the school wants to hire them. This particular person has an MA (TESOL) and is fluent in English, Korean and Tagalog. So, actually I'd say she's more qualified to teach elementary school than some BA, no teaching qualifications, no experience, can only speak English whitey just off the boat. Also, the quality of some of the posts by native speakers on here makes you wonder whether their English skills are good enough to teach English.
kavi
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Joined: 05/17/2010 - 14:22
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

True Trevor,

I find that many native teachers that come here are sure excellent in English and better than non natives because its their mother tongue but then knowing something is not about teaching the same.most of the teachers have done everything in their home countries except teaching.

Those with good qualification and teaching abilities  must have a chance to participate in the selection process whatever nationality it may be.If you prove yourself you go further or else not.

I see many post like -a white native ,a north american wanted and so so.............the discrimination is not bound to Asians or non natives but also with native speakers.Does white skin color makes u a good teacher..........I dont think so........

it should stop somewhere..............



143busan
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Joined: 08/07/2009 - 13:33
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.
I do get what you're saying here.  However, asides from public schools, English education in Korea is a business.  White faces attract parents...which is money.  That being said, I don't think it's about white or yellow or black or blue being better teachers, but a better marketing tool for the Director of respective hagwon.
lee-bum-suk
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Joined: 10/26/2009 - 08:38
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

Good morning

I think at every level here it's business; gov't school, public, private uni/college and hogwan. Our university has over 30 teachers, all of them but two are white.  Koreans think that white people are competent and that's good enough for them. They are slow to change. They should be able to hire whomever they want and I'm going to lecture them on why they should hire someone they don't even if it is a racial issue.

They want the cast of Twilight, not Bollywood; it's that simple.

ThulsaDooom
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Joined: 02/23/2010 - 20:25
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

But you're also letting your anti-whiteyness obscure the fact that no foreigner is a full-on teacher in a public school.  We're all teacher's assistants.  That one case is all well and true but where's her degree from (no disrespect intended, just a point)?  I always see people ragging on the quality of Korea's universities and that obtaining a Master's here is less than ideal for jobs outside of Korea.  What does that make, what I'm assuming is, a degree from a Filipino university?  I'd wager that the Europeans, especially Germans and Swiss that I've met speak English as fluent as if not better than the average Filipino  Why not let them come here, too?  How about Mexicans or any other Latin American country?

I think looking at someone's Internet posts as a measure of their teaching ability is very, very ignorant.

Trevor
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Joined: 08/05/2009 - 16:51
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

I'm not anti-whitey. I'm anti-native speaker who doesn't have any teaching qualifications.

Her MA is from a Korean university and she's working in Korea, so does that cut the mustard.

You argument about Germans, Swiss, etc. is basically about any non-Korean person. If they have the English skills and teaching qualifications, why not? It should be up to the organisation hiring them.

The policy that a native speaker of English with any Bachelor's degree is qualified to teach is flawed. The Talk program in which people who are studying for a degree can come and teach here is also a joke.

I didn't say that internet posts were a reflection of teaching ability. I said that internet posts were a reflection of English skill. The argument on here is that Filipino people can't speak English well enough. However, some posts by native speakers suggest they might not have the skills either.

Native speakers are hired for the fact they are, well, native speakers not necessarily their teaching qualifications (if any) or teaching skills. So, if they don't have any teaching qualifications and they also can't write properly, then why are they being hired.

Not reading posts properly could be construed as somewhat ignorant.

kilhallon
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Joined: 03/03/2010 - 19:49
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

As a non-teacher and totally incapable of producing a fluid sentence without decimating the concept of grammar, I was astounded to read some of the threads from supposedly well educated individuals with years of university education, and who are supposed to be here in Korea teaching the same subject to students. 

There seems to be a distinct lack of the most basic grasp of the concepts of correct use of plurals, sentences starting with lower case letters, incorrect punctuation, no logical thought, mixing present and past tenses and an apparent inability to form the most basic thought processes and translate this into the written word.

I am assuming that these are the same individuals who claim to have a higher ability to understand and teach this topic by virtue of their geographical educational location, and are the same ones demanding the right to 50 or 60,000 won per hour for their skills.

Come on guys, you wish to extol the virtues of a foreign education as superior to that of the Asians, for heaven's sake, proof read what you write.

Threads written in this style do little to reinforce your arguments.




     

lee-bum-suk
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Joined: 10/26/2009 - 08:38
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

Don't forget run on sentences.    

kilhallon
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Joined: 03/03/2010 - 19:49
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

Sorry, you got me there LBS. As previously mentioned, I destroy all English grammar with a sledge hammer.

Engineering topics, or ship building, I'm your man.

How about a (dare I ask it) free lesson!! 

More info on a run-on sentence please. 



 




lee-bum-suk
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Joined: 10/26/2009 - 08:38
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

I'm only joking. I'm guilty of that myself, As for other concerns; I can spell fine but I just can't type. I'm like a caveman with index fingers plugging away.

Who cares about spelling and grammar. It's the bacon that counts.Your monthly expenses account is probably more than I make in salary from the university.

kilhallon
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Joined: 03/03/2010 - 19:49
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

Ahh LBS, if only it were so. Us foreigners these days don't do as well as we used to, my expenses no longer even stretch to a good meal these days.

To be perfectly frank with most of the threads here, I really understand what the feelings are, and why. We ( the marine industry ) went through the same series of emotions and thoughts many years ago, all over the world. Salaries decimated, jobs lost, movement from country to country looking for the old days.

Disbelief that anyone could consider we were replaceable, after all, we had high level western world qualifications, we had the jobs, we had the skills required, we had the knowledge.

Frustration, that although we had all of the above, our place in the world was being eroded by cheap labour, even though that cheap labour had the same qualifications and were slowly but surely bringing salaries down.

Anger, that nothing could be done to prevent the slide.

LBS, I mentioned before that education is an industry, the same as any other, with ''supply and demand'' determining market value. I agree that in the better days, a western face may have been the only acceptable face to the Koreans. Maybe it still does in Hagwons, I don't profess to have enough knowledge to make a comment.

Now, it comes down to dollars and cents. A college or school needs to fill a teaching post. It needs a teacher with qualifications, and the ability to teach. Doesn't need a white face, doesn't need an (insert your country here) accent, just an individual to fill the post.

Yes I also agree that perhaps, people like yourself have managed to get a niche position, where you with your predominantly foreign band of brothers, can manipulate the system to your advantage.   

 Believe me it is changing, with a speed that will frighten you. Korea is coming of age, and with it, new ideals on the needs of expensive foreigners trying to enforce western ideals on a nation that doesn't want them.

Can you visualize an Indian or Philippino teaching homosexuality and gay rights to students?

Foreigners ask for too much, and demand too much, for a nation that is still not quite ready to embrace the modern western world.  

Me, I am a Project Manager for drill ships, value between 750 million and 2 billion dollars each.

Yes, I have a good salary, in fact I have an obscenely high salary for what I do. 

I'm still needed here in Asia because of my skills base and the fact that I am in a niche market. Come the day that I can be replaced with an Asian with equal skills, I am history, the same as all other higher paid foreign employees. 

Get used to it, get ready for the transition from hot kitchen to somewhere where it ain't so hot.

Take it from an old timer, bitching isn't going to change a thing.  

lee-bum-suk
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Joined: 10/26/2009 - 08:38
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

Hal....I am an old timer also and I  respect what you say but it isn't going to happen.  Koreans can only handle white people teaching their kids and that's the end of the story. I've been waiting 15 years for the Filipinos and Indians and whomever to come and take my job from me.

Really, this thread is as old as that. I heard about this 1995 and still hasn't happened, It will never will and why? because Koreans are well off enough to have white slaves, not black. Plus, have you ever dealt with Korean mothers? well let me tell you....there is no way they want their precious little Ju-me learining English from a person who is darker than they are or from a poorer country. I didn't make the rules, I just play the game.

  

kilhallon
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Joined: 03/03/2010 - 19:49
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

This is going to be "wait and see" scenario I think.

Saying that, I note that someone is selling a Hakwon on this site, and with the following comment.

""It's currently running a small loss. (Income less than expenses). So you need to be able to cover this loss until you either increase student numbers or reduce expenses."" 

So, I wonder how they can or will reduce the overheads?? I think the remedy is pretty obvious. Bye bye the expensive teachers, hello the cheaper ones.

Rules are already changing LBS, maybe not in the next week or so, but it is going to come.

lee-bum-suk
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Joined: 10/26/2009 - 08:38
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

Dear Kavi, show me a link or show me the program details but unless you have proof I'm going to concider this rumor control central.. http://www.epik.go.kr/ has no word of this anywhere on it's website. You'd think they would, wouldn't you?

More things change the more they stay the same Hal, out with the old in with the old. That's Korea motto.

In regards to the ad. People that shop for cheaper teachers are not loyal either Hal and personally my wife who runs a schools and myself have no time for such people, They say silly stuff like 'we've had many foreigners at 25,000w.class' Exactly and that's why you are looking for one now? My privates that have lasted the longest are also the most expensive ones. The cheaper ones has all gone by the roadside. English education is no different than buying any product in the free market. You buy cheap shit that's exactly what you get.

These people probably have a saturation problem of too many hogwans in the same area fighting for the same 300kids, not that the foreign teacher is too expensive.

kavi
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Joined: 05/17/2010 - 14:22
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

hi thr 

check out the notice no.141 on the same EPIK site u mentioned 

and if u need more  proof i can send you the application  and guideline files

the last date is July 12 th 

and they will be here for august orientation...................

no rumors .......its a truth..

As for me i am into teaching but nothing to do with English I taught physics and maths............

.I am off the job for a while as I am here in Korea but I have other responsibilities and I am enjoying my time

so its not my wish .............It is EPIK who is considering new aspects and more qualified teachers............

I suppose anyone whoever  is well qualified and does his job well should not be worried about other nationalities allowed for E-2.....


lee-bum-suk
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Joined: 10/26/2009 - 08:38
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

You are correct, A whopping 12 of them in fact! 1-2 twelve of them. I will worry for my job when it's 1200.

kavi
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Joined: 05/17/2010 - 14:22
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

WEll thats just beginning ...............

I stated that just as a matter of fact...........

nobody should be worried whether 12 or 1200.............there will be always space for all those who are qualified and are loyal to their jobs....

143busan
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Joined: 08/07/2009 - 13:33
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.
don't get me wrong.  i'm a yellow faced gyopo myself.  if i were in charge of making decisions for any english education establishment in korea, and the number of students that enroll was the priority agenda, i would do the same thing.  not to say it's the right way...but hey...it's just business.
kavi
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Joined: 05/17/2010 - 14:22
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

 hi thr,

its happening now...........

EPIK is hiring some Indian teachers as guest assistant teachers...for the next session ....

if it successful..........there will be more in coming years........



Dogarse
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Joined: 04/15/2010 - 23:53
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.
Don't worry Kavi, LBS always tries to change the scope of the argument when he his position is shown to be demonstrably false.

Incidentally does anyone else constantly read the title of this thread as "I hate Filipino teachers"

lee-bum-suk
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Joined: 10/26/2009 - 08:38
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

beginning? or perhaps the end.

I don't hate anyone dog. What I do find funny though is that the number of positions was not disclosed by Kavi and only THE INDIANS ARE COMING!  What is this scare whitey week?  

With those measily numbers it seems more like a political stunt to satisfy a visiting diplomat than a genuine effert to obtain Indian-English teachers.

 

kilhallon
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Joined: 03/03/2010 - 19:49
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

LBS, 

I get this feeling that you are consciously avoiding the inevitable, but admit it is happening unconsciously. Perhaps you just naturally disagree with anything stated on this site!!

beginning? or perhaps the end. Your comment I believe!!

You agreed a few weeks back that it was the worst you had seen. The rates paid without argument have halved in the past few years. So how long are they to go down before there are no foreign takers??

Hourly rates now down to half of what they were, and still going down. Soon they will level out at the rate that the long term resident "whitey" will not work for.  

Market rate.

Then in step the individuals that WILL work for these rates. Against local hourly rates, what is on offer is good even against shipyard rates for Koreans. 

Sorry my friend, the good days are gone for routine teaching jobs. 

The same situation applies to me. You want to stay in a good paying teaching job, specialize, find your niche market. They are there, you just need to identify them.

Anonymous (not verified)
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

Guys is it difficult for black africans to find teaching jobs out there, not seen comments on blacks, wondering if there are any blacks teaching out there, thanks n please don't murder me *grammatically* did i spell that right?

Angel
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Joined: 08/16/2009 - 11:51
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

To pretend you really know anything about this, is laughable. None of you, seem to really grasp the point of these programmes.They will end these, when they want to. The main Ethos is not restricted by the question of money, qualifications, or skin colour.These paranoia merchants should take a few Prozacs, or something else.In my opinion, you have missed the point. 

I think, the function of this expenditure, is to remove barriers. It's about giving their children the opportunity,a chance to feel confident with foreigners, and remove the social barriers of old. Exposure to English is the main idea, an focuses mainly in the elementary schools. 

This programme wont go on forever, will end quite soon I suspect(2 years). LBS should be safe in his University job for a while, I think Hakwons will  loving the fact they will be able to make money again when foreigners need jobs again.I think Westerners will be phased out here and there, but only in areas where Koreans are happy to have Korean teachers.

Personally, I think you are all being rude and derogatory to the fine army of Korean teachers out there. Some of the people here, couldn't lace their boots.They are your main threat, not other Asians.

kilhallon
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Joined: 03/03/2010 - 19:49
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

Angel,

I find your comments equally laughable, as will everyone else you have insulted. 

""To pretend you really know anything about this, is laughable""

So ONLY YOU have grasped the finer points of the exercise. How so very observant and intuitive you are.

Have you ever considered a career in the United Nations???

Of course ALL the comments here are personal opinions, including yours, unless you are privy to some insider information that no one else has access to.

Feel free to put forward your opinion, but try doing it in a way that doesn't require insulting other individuals that are also entitled to have their own opinions, and more importantly, airing them in public.

Perhaps then, others will look at the CONTENT of your arguments, rather than the STYLE in which you write them.  

However, saying that, I couldn't agree more with your last paragraph. Without a doubt, a large amount of their downfall is self induced, and they are their own biggest enemies.  

lee-bum-suk
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Joined: 10/26/2009 - 08:38
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

Hal I wouldn't presume to tell you anything about the shipbuilding industry. I wish you would give us the same courtesy. Angel and I have had words in the past but I respect this person's position because he/she is in the industry and not an outsider.

I really think you are out of your league here as you have little to no personal knowledge about the EFL industry in Korea. As for myself, it is all I know. I have never done anything else in my adult life than teach English in Korea. Some of you might think that is really sad, well it is what it is. My knowledge in this industry isn't solely as a teacher who has taught every age and level in the spectrum. I've helped recruit people here and my better half owns and runs an institute. There isn't an aspect of this industry that I don't have some experience in.

You say I'm not in tune with modern times and it's inevitable these people will come. I'm telling you I know this industry and I know Koreans, especially Korean mothers. I'll bet my 15years here that little to nothing in the EFL industry will change. Let's talk in 2015, it will be my 20th anniversary here and the 20th year of me hearing how the Asians are coming to take our jobs away. It will never happen.

  

kilhallon
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Joined: 03/03/2010 - 19:49
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

Hey, what's this, Education Industry closing ranks against the unbelievers??

Seriously, I have been around these parts for a few years also. I have friends in Busan who are / were teachers, one tried to start a summer school, failed dismally, etc, so, not entirely lacking in the background to the industry.

I would never consider myself knowledgeable enough to go up against anyone in "the know", but you would be very surprised how much one becomes a little blinkered as to what is going on around them when they are inside looking out.

You don't need to be here for a long period of time, nor an insider, to see the trends though, nor the changing attitudes of all concerned.

As you say, the only proof will be time. 









Angel
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Joined: 08/16/2009 - 11:51
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.
I noticed you boasting about your huge salary, perhaps you'll be gone before any of us.What are you a Log, or something like that? Some of us here, are highly qualified and skilled people. My background is in Education, so I know what I am talking about. I do have reasonable contacts in the Government, so yes, I do have some idea.I don't think it takes a rocket scientist to make the predictions you have.However, the industry here is somewhat different to others in its criteria and needs.Some of us, have backgrounds in Economics, Politics, Law, Business and other skilled majors.It seems to me you are preaching to the converted in the main.Yet, some of us with a modicum of intelligence, don't buy into the negativity. Hope that is OK with you.
kilhallon
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Joined: 03/03/2010 - 19:49
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

My comment reference my salary came as a response to LBS comment on expenses. Read the thread. Not a boast, but an embarrassment. Maybe I should give some of it to impoverished teachers.

Can't answer the comment reference the Log, assume that this is some sort of "insider teacher to student thing" 

I will be gone when they; 

a/ Stop building ships.

b/ Find someone else to replace me that has the same educational qualifications, the same skills and cheaper than me.

c/ Die.

Yes Angel, there are other people out in this big wild world that have the same qualifications as you (probably higher than yours) and skills (most certainly higher than yours) and from the same quality Universities as you ( I assume this of you as a matter of course) 

My interactions also go slightly higher than yours, where, due to my background I advise steering Committees on International Laws concerning Marine matters. 

So cut the crap about you mixing in local government. It does not impress me.

I am honoured to note that I have been "touched"  by such exalted, highly qualified and skilled people, with backgrounds in Economics, Politics, Law, Business.

This is indeed a guarantee that the changing and progressive movement towards a multi cultural balance shift within South Korea will not now take place!!! 

I believe the last time I heard this was our good friend King Canute. He was also extremely successful.

I have no intention of getting into an argument concerning how the education system works internally, that would be pure arrogance on my part. I refer only to the Industry as a whole. 

As you say, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to look at the track record of 1/ employment, 2/ salaries, 3/ negative comments (reference items 1 and 2) from the same individuals who claim that there is no negative movement in your Industry as a whole, and every thing is rosy in the garden. 

If you require some proof of this, read back on innumerable threads going back over the past couple of years, where the massive number of negative comments from your own Educational compatriots has more than emphasised the general trend.

I note that those of you "with a modicum of intelligence, don't buy into the negativity"

Glad to note that you do not consider me to have a modicum of intelligence, not that I would expect much else from you and your threads, but thanks anyhow.

My previous comments reference the contents of your threads still being a tad more important than the insults, still stands. 

Hope that is OK with you also.       


Angel
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Joined: 08/16/2009 - 11:51
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

My interactions also go slightly higher than yours, where, due to my background I advise steering Committees on International Laws concerning Marine matters. - wow, give the m--key a peanut

Yes Angel, there are other people out in this big wild world that have the same qualifications as you (probably higher than yours) and skills (most certainly higher than yours) and from the same quality Universities as you ( I assume this of you as a matter of course) - yet again, stating the obvious

If you require some proof of this, read back on innumerable threads going back over the past couple of years, where the massive number of negative comments from your own Educational compatriots has more than emphasised the general trend.-

I have no idea what numerous threads, about trends you are claiming were on here:- absolute  twaddle, nonsense.What trends, where?There aren't any general trends anywhere,this statement is vague, nebulous at best- horse man --- to be honest.Where is your proof?


Returning to the main point: 

There will always be Westerners teaching here. If not, they will move to China, Taiwan, Vietnam, etc.For a small minority of us, it's a good career here. For the transient other, it's just an earner.For the main, people will move on, have to, or be moved on.Most of us, are aware of this fact, we don't need people to teach us, to suck eggs.Perhaps we impoverished teachers, could help you with your reading skills.You seem to be blinkered,and see only what suits your mind set.Lastly, your salary was mentioned again, and contact dropping now.Don't feel sorry for us teachers, Professors.I can assure you that we can afford a beer,or two.In fairness, you weigh in with your fair share of insults. Why don't you stick to the Steering, and let the experts get on with our sector.Shipping industries in places like the UK, Spain and former USSR are dead. I guess you must be glad of a job. Perhaps, they will have a job for you in West Africa, under a flag of convenience , when you are finished here.Ships are quite slow, what about the people in the industry?The Marine Industry, or is Maritime?


kilhallon
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Joined: 03/03/2010 - 19:49
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

Just to expand a few comments from your previous threads.

Don't feel sorry for us teachers, Professors . So now we have the arrogance to differentiate yourself from the rank and file within the Industry. Perhaps this is your way within education. 

Teacher / professor, whatever, you still perform the same function, you teach.

Why don't you stick to the  Steering. 

Definition of steering is to alter the course, to control the direction. Yes I have every intention of continuing to do so. Surprisingly enough, and most certainly a disappointment to you, I have no connection to a Flag Administration, but with I.M.O. ( U.N.) 

So, yet another bit of name dropping. Another peanut perhaps? Soon have a bag full. 

Just defining the ground here, justify my existence?

I am getting on in years, no worries on the job score, no need to move to Africa thanks, too bloody hot there. You mention Spain as a major ship building industry, you obviously know something the rest of the world does not. Just to bring you up to speed on a topic you obviously know very little about, but make comments on, Korea has recently gone into partnership with "former USSR" to resurrect ship building. Purely political, but an industry all the same. 

As you so correctly point out, this discussion has deviated somewhat from the original thread.

For a small minority of us, it's a good career here.

I find this comment quite illuminating, as we are no longer discussing the same concept now. There is an immense difference between the upper levels of your Industry and the rank and file workers. I accept your comment as obvious, and does not require comment. 

However, this thread does not discuss that. It concentrates on the lower end of the market place, where basic teaching positions are being eroded, both in conditions and salary. 

The general discussion was whether Asians would replace foreigners, in general, not at your level. My argument was yes they will, and still remains the same. This does not require in depth knowledge of your industry, it requires the ability to read. 

No, I have no requirements from your industry to teach me that thanks. I would suggest however, that you research a little more and get a better understanding of the rank and file within the education industry. 

I spent an hour earlier, and counted over 50 negative comments on this site reference declining conditions, made in the last 2 months. If you are incapable of discovering these yourself, perhaps someone with a little more research ability may be able to assist you.

I would offer, but too busy making money for my enforced retirement in some West African country.

I will apologise to anyone that I have offended, you included, if my thread is insulting, this is not normally my way, but I DO respond with like for like.  

Angel
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Joined: 08/16/2009 - 11:51
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

Ship building- Ever heard of Cadiz?

Returning to the topic- I wonder who made those 50 negative comments, and in what is their situational context ?For example- Are they people who live here, do they just exist here, or are they cash transients?I think you are correct, in the assumption that Asians will take over,and these will be Koreans.I will repeat, that as long as there is a market, Westerners will have jobs. That's if they want them(Koreans and Westerners).

Conditions- Whether conditions will be the same,get worse or better, is debatable.It is up to the Ministry of Education, and market at large here to determine this, not me.Presently, the short fall in part time ( arabite) jobs are being filled by F4 visas, F type visas via marriage, and some illegal students.To be honest, and with all due respect to you,I debate whether Korea will ever be looking to employ Asians from other countries, en masse. This, especially when the gaps can be filled by F Visa types from the within.

Research- Actually, if you had done some detailed research into the industry; read the journals; blogs;papers here;you will find that money isn't the issue.I think Korea has made its choice, structured its programme to foster confidence.Koreans can teach Grammar, why do they need us? The average Korean, has a far better grasp of it, than many people I know.Pieceofmeat put it well years ago, when he wrote that it was an immersion programme. The marinading, immersion must be almost at an end, let's watch the resurgence of the Hakwon business. 

Up to the Individual- conditions have and will always be slightly ropey  here, but that's up to the individual.People come here without proper research, and get caught out.You get what you get. People often blame owners for their own short comings, lack of talent or pure stupidity.Let's give the people here some credit, they take us on without knowing much about us.The gamble is two way street, how many midnight runs, incomplete contacts, bad behaviour have they seen?This is a free market and people get burnt on both sides.At least Greg at ATEK, is trying to protect the rights of the individual.If people want to work for any condition and provide the service, it's a personal choice.

Condescending of other Asian nations-The truth is that Philippines, Indians, Malays are all well educated and excellent teachers. However, it seems that Korean parents in the main, refuse to accept them. How will the market stand them? Especially, if Parents don't want these excellent teachers in their schools.The market has been in place for years,and demand for foreigner from Western countries is still very strong. Why do Koreans send their children to camps in the Philippines?People are also assuming that other Asians will work here, for less than us.I thought incomes were going up in these nations recently, eg the Indian professional and middle classes.Why would they come here? To commit to a programme, that will end soon enough.

The Future- I would say, they are more likely to invest in Chinese teachers, as they are doing right now. Many schools have fostered University partnerships, where Chinese exchange teachers are coming over here, to teach, for a year.Thus, in essence, perhaps you may be right, if we look at just teaching.

kilhallon
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Joined: 03/03/2010 - 19:49
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

Angel, thank you for your detailed response, probably more due to the weather than me, but still appreciated.

It is exceptionally intriguing for me to have the opportunity of an insight into the education system here in Korea, especially at both your level and with your length of time in Korea, as most of my knowledge comes from much further down the feed chain.

Also, I have been described as a "country boy" coming from Koje, not a "city boy" (quote from a Korean) so not really up to speed on the intricacies of higher education.   

I believe that most, if not all of the comments concerning lowering conditions / salary etc. do come from the rank and file, who have possibly been primed by the old timers. There is nothing worse than us old timers claiming that things were so much better in our days. Regretfully, we tend to conveniently "forget" the painful bits!! 

I totally endorse your comments reference the skills and abilities of other Asian nations, yes their abilities and grammatical knowledge are quite astounding. What does intrigue me is the reluctance of Korean parents to accept these nations as an acceptable alternative to white foreigners.  

Following the recent discussions on the topic of homosexuality being discussed in schools, I have asked many of my Korean friends (who are also parents) whether the new generation of Koreans were prepared to discuss this with their children, and all agreed that the topic was considered to be acceptable in this day and age. However, none of the same parents would have considered this as possible with THEIR parents. 

A reoccurring theme throughout these discussions, was the immense change of direction that the modern Korean now accepts. The old concepts, standards and beliefs seem to be changing so rapidly, and I also wonder whether the rejection of the differing nationality of teachers will moderate within the same time scale. 

It is a topic that I will bring up as a general discussion point in the near future.   

You surprise me with the Chinese concept of alternative teachers. I always believed that the working structure between Hangol and say for instance, Manderin, was so diametrically opposite, that this would have been a serious impediment, not only for vocabulary but pronunciation. 

Having worked in China for a few years, I still have difficulty in understanding the spoken word. 

The structure of the Korean education system remains a mystery to me, and I would never make a comment on this, nor would I venture an opinion on the way the Government wishes to move forward. As previously commented, I refer only to the basic "rank and file" end of the industry.

As for Cadiz being classed as a ship building centre, now or in the past, someone has been winding you up!! 

Ship building yes, but certainly not world class.

rebeccalozen
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Joined: 08/06/2009 - 22:05
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.
I know some Fillipinos who live and work in Korea. Their English is good enough to carry on a conversation with me fluently. I know some native speakers who I constantly have to ask them to slow down or repeat themselves. We have the best and worst of both worlds here in Korea. Having said that, I will explain very clearly what native speakers have that cannot necessarily be taught in a classroom. We have the gift of English conversation. That includes idioms and slang as well. The Korean government hires us, as native speakers, to teach the conversation side of English. The Koreans and Fillipinos or any other ESL citizen can teach the phonics and grammar part. To truly be able to understand how conversation works in a country you have to listen and observe someone from that country and copy what they do or say. The government is bringing in people from other countries to teach? Maybe they are beginning to realize that just having conversation skills is not enough anymore. You can not control how the government works or what it chooses to do. I don't understand why people are so concerned with this. You have a stable job right now, with a decent salary--much higher that you would get in your own country for teaching. Why are you complaining about the fact that the Korean government is bringing on more teachers from another country? I just don't understand. Maybe I'm too 'babo' or something, but I'm happy having a job, a salary, a place to live and money to pay for little things like Starbucks.
kilhallon
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Joined: 03/03/2010 - 19:49
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

rebeccalozen,

Thank you for getting us all back on track of the original thread.

My own little added bit would be that originally, the important interactions between Korea and the rest of the world used to be principally America, and secondary Europe. So your observation concerning idioms and slang were important.

Korea now looks for trade world wide, with very high value exports i.e. nuclear power stations (UAE) desalination plants (Saudi Arabia) construction (UAE) shipbuilding (Brazil, China and Russia) which no longer require anything but good basic English, so your summation could well be spot on. 

But Starbucks??



lee-bum-suk
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Joined: 10/26/2009 - 08:38
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

Thought I'd chime in on a point or two.

In regards to the homosexuality chat, the parents you talk to Hal are telling you what you want to hear. They have you as a foreign friend and they want to be new and hip and western and I guess gay is ok this year. I have nothing against gays or lesbians by the way but it should not be in any way shape or form included in an English lesson taught by a foreigner to children or even young adults.

Note: to those of you who say you have taught about homosexuality in the classroom to young adults or children then please record your video and post it on this site.I'm really sick of people saying that have when I know they haven't. Prove it, or be silent! Come on you do the same lesson at least 3-6-9 times a week. Show me the lesson!!!  I said you'd be fired in a week, prove me wrong.  

Oh Hal.....did you know that Koreans let their children run around in restaurants because they think it's 'very western'?  If I acted like an animal my mother would have blistered my ass.  You should see what they've done to the beautiful game of golf. It's more stressful to play here than driving a car, I'm not lying.  

Why do Koreans send kids to the Phillippines?  It's cheaper. Who would send there kids there if they had the money to go to the USA or Canada or Europe? It's the money or lack of it. People with money wouldn't concider this place, sending your kids abroad is a status thing. Unless they were university student looking for a good time and hanging out on the beach. No studying required. I certainly wouldn't be studying in Boracay.    

shaneliv
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Joined: 03/28/2011 - 13:47
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

I worked in a Korean Academy and for dealing with them for about 9months i already understand their nature. Well, its not necessary to unfold these matters but then lets just trust with our fellowmen. Ideally, they are far different from us esp. when it comes to relationships such as being friends. I've been aware with their hidden and visible personalities but then i was able to meet few genuine koreans. 


Anyway guys, as a teacher i could tell you so that Filipinos are really great when it comes to teaching. I worked with other nationalities and they always have this common positive feedback on "US".  Regardless of these issues about the discrimination, i still have a faith on our god given talents and skills.


Recently, im planning to travel and if fortunate i wanna work in Korea. However, i often heard bout these stuffs and it makes me wanna think twice.  Hopefully, we could  have good opportunities in this country... in the near future. good luck to us!

Dogarse
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Joined: 04/15/2010 - 23:53
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.
Can anyone spot the irony here?
Paul Gaasenbeek
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Joined: 08/25/2009 - 15:04
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.
this thread is from last summer.  some just never die.
lovelyrich1979
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Joined: 09/30/2011 - 17:28
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

There a lot of Korean students go to the Philippines to study English. Some of them stayed there for 5 or 6 years and when they come back to Korea they are very proud that they can speak English better than other Koreans. And when you ask them where did they study or how did they learn  English they would say that they studied English in Canada or America. Hmmmm ( I knew some koreans doing this) It is clearly discrimination.

One thing more in our previous Academy. There was 1 American, 1  South African, 1 Australian and 2 Filipino teachers. Sorry to say but there are a lot of parents complained against them because they only read books in the class.Thy don`t even know how to explain the book ( yes, I was in their class). The boss, korean teachers and students love the Filipino teachers because they are creative, smart, sweet and above all they have good classroom management. The result is the boss asked them to stay in her academy for 4 years. They are still there now. What I`m trying to say is not all Filipinos speak bad English. Because I know that not all Filipinos who are teaching in Korea are teachers too. Why not hired a real Filino English teachers?

Some Koreans like native English speakers and maybe because they are white but  some of them are not really teachers. Only it`s easy for them to teach in Korea because  they are  native speakers but some of them don`t even know how to teach.

No offends to you guys.. Of course  not all of you but some of you.

 

 

Dogarse
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Joined: 04/15/2010 - 23:53
Re: I hope Filipino English Teachers can work in Korea.

"not all Filipinos speak bad English"

But not all Koreans speak bad English either, why not hire them?

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